scholarship students
An interview with the first scholarship students on the Foundation’s Franco-American programme
This August, the first students to benefit from the Foundation’s Franco-American exchange programme set off for New York. We invited four of them¾a photographer, an apprentice stage designer, a textile design student and an interior architecture student, all 25 years old¾ to share their views on this first scholarship programme. Currently at the School of Decorative Arts or the National School of Industrial Design in Paris, they are bound for the School of Visual Arts and the Fashion Institute of Technology in New York, spending a semester at these most prestigious of US schools. Here are their thoughts and views, along with reproductions of their works.
In a few days’ time, you’ll be setting off for New York as part of the Fondation Carla Bruni-Sarkozy’s Franco-American exchange programme. What are you hoping for from this study trip to the States?
Camille P.: I’m a stage designer at ENSAD, (the National School of Decorative Arts). I’m not going to New York with a set learning agenda in mind¾it’s more about opening up to new things, a way of working, identifying exactly what I want. I imagine it’ll be quite different there¾the teaching seems freer. I’m going to use the opportunity to work on a personal project and come back, when the semester is over, with new insights and more perspective on what it is I’m doing.
Do you need to go all that way to achieve that kind of perspective?
Spending time with people from a different culture is bound to give me a different view of things. My initial impression is that, artistically speaking, they operate differently there, with an approach that is less deeply theoretical than at my school in France.
Martin G.: It’s more theoretical at ENSAD?
Camille P.: Yes, in my department, actual output is limited, perhaps one item per semester. That can occasionally be frustrating, even if the long-term result is more clearly defined. I have the impression the pace will be faster at the School of Visual Arts in New York.
Audrey, in your motivation letter you wrote about a practical approach in the States that you wouldn’t necessarily find in France…
Audrey B.: I meant a different approach to textiles. In my department at ENSCI (the National School of Industrial Design), we deal with textiles in terms of both fashion and furniture, but the training focuses on production techniques without really getting to grips with these applied areas. I began with a diploma in product design, which helped me see the fit between textiles and objects in terms of furniture, something I didn’t necessarily get with fashion and clothing. In that respect, FIT (the Fashion Institute of Technology) will complement what I know, offering me a more creative sort of training, something related to trends, to a whole fashion culture, giving me a broader view of textiles and helping me then choose between fashion and objects, or indeed combine the two.
And you, Martin, will be at the School of Visual Arts…
Martin G.: Here, I’m at ENSAD, in the interior architecture department, but there I’ll be in the Interior Design section. I don’t really know what’s ahead of me there in concrete terms, in terms of a project. It’s a journey into the complete unknown, and that’s what I like about it¾a new way of understanding my work. From that point of view, everything I experience there will be positive. …
You are also going to the School of Visual Arts…
Melvyn B.: Yes, to study photography. What am I expecting? In fact for the last four years at the School of Decorative Arts here, we’ve experienced one sort of teaching approach. So I’m looking forward to a new way into photography. It’s also a different kind of education in the States. They’re brought up differently from childhood. There’ll be a lot to learn from that, complementing what we’ve learned on our courses in France.
Camille P.: If you look at the school prospectuses, you get a sense of a more professionally-oriented approach, which you don’t get so much in Paris. There they put you in touch with gallery owners, professionals from ever sector, and encourage you to be independent, ready for the world of work. In Paris, I feel I’m in a cocoon. Here, once you’ve got your degree, you get the impression you’ve been let loose in a jungle without much experience under your belt, at least in the world of theatre design.
Melvyn B.: In New York, you learn more about adapting to a professional world. Before ENSAD, I did an advanced technical qualification in editing. Now that I can edit, I’ve learnt to make a living from that. ENSAD certainly broadens your mind but doesn’t teach you how to get out there and market your work …
Audrey B.: At FIT, there will be speakers and workshops. Will you have that sort of thing?
Martin G.: On the SAV (School of Visual Arts) website, they say that the teachers often take on their students more as paid workers than as interns. Perhaps not right from the first year, but neither do they wait until the final year. I’d really like to be able to do an internship as a result of this trip.
Coming back to your initial training, what really set you off in choosing your particular paths in France?
Audrey B.: I was in product design. As time went by, I began, perhaps subconsciously, to feel that my work had a textile feel to it, whether in terms of my way of looking at objects, or my choice of materials. So I told myself it would be interesting to do a sort of dual training that married the two and ENSCIs textile department seemed the best option. With my product design higher diploma in applied arts, which is a fairly theoretical qualification, the practical and technical learning at ENSCI helped me bridge a gap.
Melvyn B.: I didn’t really see myself doing anything else. Photography and video¾in fact anything visual¾is how I relate to the world. I don’t know how to write as such¾words and figures don’t really express what I feel. But I was lucky enough to be brought up in an atmosphere where people took a positive view of that world. Because it’s one thing to have hopes, but that’s not enough… it’s always much easier when your family is behind you. At art schools, many of the students have parents or family members from that world.
Camille P.: I made a lot of scale models when I was younger, but I was at a Paris secondary school that took a dim view of the arts – it was all about maths. After my baccalaureate, I did law. It was also something pragmatic¾studying arts is bound to lead to failure. But then all of a sudden in my third year of law, I decided to stop. I just couldn’t see myself carrying on: I would have flipped by the time I was 30. So I went back to square one. I opted for theatre design, because it links up to many fields, contemporary art etc… At ENSAD, things are fairly compartmentalised into space, image and object. I wanted to focus on space¾the process whereby you start with a text and then end up with an object or an installation.
Do you have to be in Paris to study art?
Audrey B.: Not necessarily, or at least not to start with. I made my way up step by step, from Corail Téoz in Clermont-Ferrand to Paris. I’m from Vichy. I did my advanced technical diploma in Product Design at Moulins, then a higher diploma in applied arts in Nevers, before getting to Paris. There are very good schools across the country, but it’s in Paris that you can really come into your own. There are heaps of galleries and museums, which is important when you’re in the creative world. And you get to meet people too.
Melvyn B.: Given my experience of two places, I was delighted with the teaching I got in Bayonne, despite feeling I didn’t receive encouragement for all my ideas. At some stage, I think you have to pass through Paris or another European capital.
Martin G.: Me, I come from Brittany, where there are no real applied arts schools. The few ones you do find there are private. I was lucky enough to be accepted in Paris, where all the good schools are¾the ones that are rated.
Studying is also about the place itself. Have you found out much about New York in terms of your own interests?
Audrey B.: Yes, New York is one of the fashion capitals, but on a different scale, a bigger scale. Everything there is enormous.
It’s a launch pad?
Martin G.: Well for a start it’s going to help us with English. Then it can make all the difference to your CV¾ it’s a sort of springboard, or …trampoline. Do I mean trampoline?
Take your pick… In your motivation letter, Martin, you talk of the costs involved in this sort of trip, which you’d never have been able to afford without outside help…
Definitely. 6 months in New York, that’s $12,000, quite apart from the tuition fees. Could I have coped with a sum like that? It would have been a sacrifice, or I’d have had to borrow.
Audrey, you took out a loan for your studies in Paris. Was that your decision?
Audrey B.: I’d talked to my parents about it. My dad works in a bank and told me that it was certainly a solution.
Martin G.: But I imagine it will affect the first work we do when we graduate: we won’t be choosing the most interesting work but whatever allows us to repay the debt the quickest.
Camille P.: But when you finish, loan or not, you still want to earn money …
Melvyn B.: But then your motives are different. There’s a difference between getting by with little money and having a loan weighing you down.
How do art school students manage financially, from your point of view?
Camille P.: My mum lives in Paris, which is lucky for me. I live with her, so I had no accommodation issues, even though I really want to move out, and I think about that all the time. But I couldn’t afford that at the moment, not even if I had a job on the side.
Melvyn B.: It’s the same for me¾my mum moved to Paris. We’re lucky to be in state schools anyway¾a private school was out of the question for me, But I guess it’s difficult for those students who have to work to get by, on top of the course.
Audrey B.: What’s tough is having to break away when you’re deeply involved in a project. I do babysitting, which means time away from school, which you then have to catch up. That means spending evenings and weekends at the school.
Melvyn B.: I do editing on the side, which is easier than babysitting, because you get €200 a day. But mentally it’s still difficult to be in a job where you have to work like crazy for money and then get back into reflecting on art. The constant to-ing and fro-ing is wearing, becase they’re two opposite worlds.
Martin G.: We were chosen for this programme, amongst other things, because we were scholarship students. But when you look at the number of scholarship students in the decorative arts, we’re around 20%. That’s not so much.
Camille P.: Studying art is a risky business really. On the other hand, we’re quite spoilt, as we cost the taxpayer more than most other students. But people with little money rarely take the plunge. The only way I could do it was by staying with my mother, I didn’t have the problem of having to earn money right away.
You think social context plays a determining role in taking up art studies?
Camille P.: It’s more a question of education. My parents weren’t from an arty background.
Audrey B.: Yes, it’s about open-mindedness. I know my grandmother was very drawn to the art world. She passed that on to me that and my parents were open to it.
Martin G.: Even though my parents aren’t arty, and are even a little worried about all this, but what really counts is that they give me the freedom to believe in it.
Camille P.: It’s always the same for long courses¾5 years minimum. When you don’t have the money, you make do with a 3-year course …
In such cases, the priority is to make money as quickly as possible. But you have to reflect on building a career, which you have to know about. Allowing yourself to follow your desires is hard too …
Martin G.: You were saying, Camille, about the fun you had in making models. So yes, the thing is to be able to say, when thinking about your future, that you can make a living from what you love doing. These arts subjects are not always highly regarded. I had to go to the documentation and information centre to look up some document, and when I told the professors what I was doing, they looked down on me as if to say ‘Oh yeah… you arty-farty types’. But these are real professions, which have their place in the system …
Camille P.: And where you can make a decent living too. I got my baccalaureate in 2002. For three years at school they kept harping on about unemployment¾enough to really get you down. The professors immediately discouraged anyone who wanted to be an architect. You had to be either an engineer, or in business. So I did a foundation class for business school before I did law. In my case, maybe if I hadn’t had that background and made those mistakes, I wouldn’t have ended up at ENSAD.
Melvyn B.: There’s no straight line towards a set destination. You have to keep your options open. There are many doors, and we have to choose those which seem best suited for us. Before going to ENSAD, I wasn’t into photography. It certainly appeals to me, but I haven’t shut the other doors all the same.
Camille P.: We’re also lucky to be able to travel. New York is a real opportunity …
Melvyn B.: … one of those doors opening up to us.
Martin G.: It’s a typical French way of thinking. In English-speaking countries, students often take a gap year abroad. In France that’s seen as a waste of time! Although it can only be a good thing¾both personally and professionally. But if you tell your parents you’re about to take off for a year round the world, their reaction will be ‘what are you, a tourist?’
In that case, public-private partnerships like this kind of Foundation sponsorship can be of help…
Melvyn B.: We’re beneficiaries, so it’s difficult to be objective. It’s also a label, and doesn’t it mean we might be seen as being part of the Fondation Carla Bruni-Sarkozy?
You feel you’re being used?
Not in the slightest! But it’s not a neutral thing¾we’re talking about the First Lady of France. I don’t know how that will be viewed.
Camille P.: We’re not only selected on merit. Social criteria are the main factors.
Martin G.: No, in the Foundation literature, they say that student selection takes both merit and financial need into account. It’s more that there are ten of us and that we come with this First Lady of France label attached …
Audrey B.: Yes, like a stamp of respectability, a sort of ‘recommendation’. I don’t know about you, but I haven’t even had time to send my book to the FIT!
Martin G.: Our arrival has already been flagged up on the School of Visual Arts website, which adds a bit of pressure. We don’t want to disappoint the Foundation, the host school or ourselves. If all they see is four tourists arriving…
